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Tifflin' & fiddlin' & fettlin'

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Mike Garnham09/05/2008 22:09:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos

Andy,

yes, I completely agree. As I said at the end of my piece, I think the improvement I noticed in the bigger plane was due to the work on the blade, and not the sole.......I only finished the work on the sole only out of academic interest.

The block plane, on the other hand, was convex when viewed from the end, and so did benefit from a bit of flattening out.

I think it is really important to think .....How does this tool work in principle? What am I really doing this for?

Mike,

I did flatten the chip breaker.......I just felt I had the potential to bore people to tears so didn't describe that in my text! I also cleaned up the seat of the frogs...although, to be fair, they were in pretty good order. When I reassembled I also closed down the mouth a bit. Not sure if this will make any difference.

As I have said, one day I will go and visit that nice Mr Charlesworth.....if I did, I would take my own planes along. His reaction might be interesting!

I am not familiar with Autosol. What is it? I merely dabbed a bit of 3 in 1 on the steel, smeared it around then wiped it off.

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Thanks for your interest fellas......my next job is to make a replacement for the broken plastic handle. I'm not sure whether to laminate it out of oak with grains runnning at right angles......or to fashion something out of a lump of 25mm ply. The first will probably break....the second will probably be ugly as a mule and give me splinters!

Mike

Mike Garnham09/05/2008 22:21:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos

Sparky,

you make my point for me. These planes served me well for years (in fact, I managed with only the big one until about 3 or 4 years ago when I aquired the block plane).....and you learn how to achieve what you need to achieve. Instinctively, for instance, I never plane with the blade square to the work.......I always skew. However, I tried the newly-fettled planes square-on today, because I saw that in a video of David charleswoth's students. It worked, and it would never have worked before.

As for "reading a newspaper though the shavings" or "producing shavings thinner than a gnat's whisker" ..........I just don't get it, don't care, and don't want to know! I am interested in what is left behind, not what is taken away!

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Bob,

do you mean "was the work on the planes worth it" or "was the work on the article worth it"?

If the former, then flattening the blades and sharpening on glass was a good lesson well learned. Flattening the sole of the smaller plane was probably worthwhile, but it is still most likely to be mainly used for chamfering edges!

If you meant the latter.......well, that is for you and others to judge!

Mike

Matthew Platt09/05/2008 23:12:00
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347 forum posts
9 photos

Mike,

Thin shavings are desirable for three reasons.

Firstly, they seperate from the workpiece more readily, leaving a finer surface finish with less chance of tearout - especially in tricky grain.

Second, a plane is accurate to the thickness of the shaving over the length of the sole, so the thinner the shaving and/or the longer the sole, the more accurately you can flatten a surface with it.

Last but not least, thinner shavings give you much more control - sneaking up on a knifed line to accurately thickness a board for example. 

I must admit, my first reaction to the sole of your smoother was the same as Andy's - a prime case of do nothing, but in the end you reached that conclusion too. As for the handles, why not just use solid timber? Something strong like elm or oak would work beautifully.

 Cheers,

Matthew

www.workshopheaven.com

Mike Riley09/05/2008 23:37:00
337 forum posts
5 photos
5 articles
Autosol is a metal polish, you can buy it in most places that sell car accessories. I guess the word Autosol is probably a brand name and I'm guilty of calling a vacuum cleaner a hoover! Apologies if so, As for the read through shavings the point is that if your shaving is that fine then you can, as Matthew says, sneak up on a knife line for an precise thickness of board for example. More precise thicknessing that you will ever achieve with a machine I suspect - certainly true in my own case. Cheers Mike
Olly Parry-Jones10/05/2008 10:30:00
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2776 forum posts
636 photos

Glad to hear made some real progress with the block plane at least, Mike.

You should really have a go at making a wooden handle. I don't see the need to laminate anything (unless you're lacking any offcuts in that thickness), but the grain appears to run in the same direction as the length of the sole, on my planes... Yes, you'd think this might give it a weakness but I've not snapped a handle yet! I think the other reason for this is so you don't have unsightly end-grain looking up at you and, more importanty, it's to do with drilling the hole for the screw.

You should be able to do it with a bandsaw, some abrasive paper and files or rasps (if you don't have a bobbin sander, like I do!

Mike Garnham10/05/2008 10:40:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos

Matthew, Mike,

Granted that thin shavings have their advantages, of course. Even-thickness shavings would strike me as a priority, though. The student on the David Charlesworth video who boasts of a shaving 2 one-hundredths of a mm thick is the sort of extreme I was alluding to. You simply cannot draw a line to anywhere near that accuracy on wood, so to have your plane set up so that it would take 50 passes to remove a millimetre seems a bit pointless.

As for the handle....it is the grain direction that worries me in solid timber. Whichever way you orientate the grain it looks as thought there is a thin weak-point where the handle will snap. Hence my thinking re laminating it, with the grains at right angles. 

I'll look out for Autosol. 

Mike 

Doug10/05/2008 11:12:00
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3415 forum posts
35 photos

Mike wrote :-

"You simply cannot draw a line to anywhere near that accuracy on wood, so to have your plane set up so that it would take 50 passes to remove a millimetre seems a bit pointless"

Surely the point is you remove the main timber with thicker shavings, then the final timber is removed with the finest shaving you can produce so minimising any sanding etc.

I haven`t seen the Charlesworth student, but if he can produce a shaving of one-hundredths of a millimetre, then i imagine the piece would be ready for finishing without any further surface preparation.

It is only the same as i do when surface planing, i set the machine to take 1 to 2 mm off, then when i`m near to my dimensions i reduce the depth of cut to a minimum. So giving the best finish possible from the machine.

Baz.

Matthew Platt10/05/2008 12:00:00
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347 forum posts
9 photos

Mike wrote :-

"To have your plane set up so that it would take 50 passes to remove a millimetre seems a bit pointless."

David is one of the very few Makers who teaches to exhibition standards. He expects a working tolerance of one tenth of a mm, so with a plane set to take a 2 thou shaving  you've only got four chances to get it just right and then one full length shaving to remove any marks.

Cheers,

Matthew

www.workshopheaven.com

Doug11/05/2008 09:49:00
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3415 forum posts
35 photos

Matthew.

I did get chance to see Daivd Charlesworth at a woodworking show. He was demonstrating Lie Nielsen planes if i remember rightly, though it was a few years ago.

He certainly had those planes set up beautifully, managing to take a full shaving off end grain oak. The result was the end grain looked polished, certainly something to aspire to.

Mike.

Do you have a link to the Charlesworth student you refered to, though i dought i have time to achieve these standards, there is always something to learn.

Cheers all.

Baz.

Mike Garnham11/05/2008 10:34:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos

Baz,

the clip is here , and you have to select the top video from the list of 4 or 5.

Olly,

I have decided to do it laminated....if it doesn't do the trick, I'll do it in solid timber next weekend!

Stop rubbing it in!!! You can see from all the curvy stuff I've made over the years that I would rather like a bobbin sander!......I've had to make another home-made drum sander for this job, due to the very small radii involved.

Picture later.

Mike 

Doug11/05/2008 12:03:00
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3415 forum posts
35 photos

Thanks Mike.

At £660 for a weeks course, i`ll have to wait till i win the lottery to attend one.Till then i`ll get by with my old No 8.

Baz.

Mike Garnham11/05/2008 17:04:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos

Baz,

660 buys an awful lot of wood!

Olly et al.......

new handle as promised:

/sites/5/images/member_albums/6440/New_handle_3.jpg


Five 6mm layers of oak, laminated at right angles.

/sites/5/images/member_albums/6440/New_handle_2.jpg


So thats it! My plane is completely finished for another 20 years!!!

Mike

Olly Parry-Jones11/05/2008 19:15:00
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2776 forum posts
636 photos

Beautiful Mike!

But, come on! You can't leave the knob at the front of the plane looking like that?! Surely you have enough spare oak to turn a new one on your friend's lathe? You've gone this far...

By the way, after the success of my two smoothing planes, I decided to tackle the knob and handle on my Jack Plane. So, here are the results of before...

/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_OLD1.JPG


/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_OLD2.JPG

And then, after...

/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_NEW1.JPG


/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_NEW2.JPG


/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_NEW3.JPG


/sites/5/images/member_albums/4477/Stanley_No.5_NEW4.JPG


I'm delighted with how well these have turned out. They seem to have come out even nicer than the ones I did on my smoothing planes - but, I guess that's down to practice. There's was nothing wrong with the old finish at all, I just really don't like it and, as you can see, it was hiding such beautiful grain.

Mike Garnham11/05/2008 20:06:00
4114 forum posts
1 photos
You knew I was kidding, Olly.......
/sites/5/images/member_albums/6440/New_knob_1.jpg


/sites/5/images/member_albums/6440/New_knob_2.jpg


......and I didn't use a lathe!

Roughed out on the bandsaw, then whacked a 4 inch nail through it and put it in the pillar drill......started with a really course rasp then the belt-sander, and worked down to a fine sandpaper by hand. Liseed oil and wax.....job done!

Yours looks good......am I right in thinking this was a cleaning-up job on existing handles, rather than starting from scratch?

Mike

Olly Parry-Jones12/05/2008 09:28:00
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2776 forum posts
636 photos

That's right Mike. I really don't like those old thick, plasticcy varnish-type finishes, which eventually start to peel and lift off. So, I decided to bring out the hidden beauty of the timber with some oil and wax.

Not a bad job there Mike, for someone without a lathe. I'd have probably used a thicker wooden dowel rather than a 4" nail (I can rarely hit those things straight anyway...!) but, the results look like a definite improvement.

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