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    Sound proofing
    1 to 20 of 34 messages. Page: 1  2  To post a reply you need to be a member - Join now.
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    Hi all,

    I would be interested to hear peoples views on how best to sound proof a timber framed workshop?

    Rob

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    Robbie,

    I guess you mean sound-proofing to keep the neighbours happy?

    Ideally, a heavyweight construction is part of the answer, but as you have a timber framed building, the key is the type of insulation you use. Mineral fibre insulation ("fibreglass"), cut oversize and tightly fitted between the studs and joists is the start. Sound waves seek out gaps, so take great care not to leave any. Use as much mineral wool as you can find space for.

    Draft strips around doors and windows will make a really big difference. 

    Do use double glazing. If you only have single glazing, then a home-made secondary glazing  set-up will help no end.

    Given the impracticality of hanging heavy curtains in a workshop, the only other thing you might consider is lining the inside of your shed with an acoustic dampening board. These come in a variety of guises.........some are covered in hessian, some have dozens of little holes per square inch, and some are just "furry". I imagine that all of them would be susceptible to damage in a workshop, so have a good look around before you buy. Let me know if you plan to go down this route, and I can look up the alternatives for you. 

    Hope this helps.

    Mike 

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    After the insulation, plaster board is fairly cheap. On site i`ve seen 2 different  thicknesses of board put one on top of another.

    Different thicknesses break up the soundwave, i`ve seen a thin rubber membrain put between layers of plasterboard to.

    The new building regs have gone to town on noise, so there are loads of new products, like sound board, it just depends on your budget.

    But from what i`ve been told multi layers of differing thickness is the key.

    Baz

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    Plasterboard is good because of its density, but I'm not sure I would want plasterboard on my workshop walls. I always think of plasterboard as talcum powder wrapped in paper!

    A protective layer of something over the plasterboard would work. Ideally, one of the acoustic boards, but even OSB would  be OK. 

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    Thanks Guys,

    I was thinking along the lines of 100mm fibreglass between the studs and then 9 or 12mm ply over the top. Maybe peg board would be better than ply then as it has loads of holes?

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    Yep, Robbie......that will be perfect. Ply can act almost like a sounding board.........bouncing the sound around.
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    Thanks Mike / Baz.  
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    I'd avoid fibreglass as a sound insulator as it's rubbish! Rockwool or mineral wool is a far better sound insulator and is the type of material specified in new builds and extensions these days. The technique of layering two boards of differential thicknesses works, but make sure that the joints are offset from each other and consider trying to get a 10 to 15mm air gap between boards using battening bonded to the face of the under board with a building adhesive such as GripFill

    Scrit

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    Scrit,

    the different thicknesses thing is a red herring. The ability of plasterboard to reduce the passage of sound is directly related to the total thickness: the more, the better. Staggering the joints is so as to not leave a straight path for sound, and is good practise. 

    As I said previously, though, plasterboard may not be the best material in a workshop.

    Mike 

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    Rob

    Alan Holthan did a artical on this go Tools & Workshop at top of page then go Setting up shop pt1 its near the bottom of page.

    I used to build my workshop 3 years ago 3''x 2'' stud-work 24'' on center with the rockwool wish I'd put plastic on that, then 12mm ply which in great for hanging stuff on the walls. you know floor space is a premium, i also insulated the roof the same way and the floor with polystyrene so warm in winter cool'ish in summer also i used internal sliding shutters on the windows mainly for security. I don't have any complaints from my neighbours as i've done 3 jobs for the one side and 2 for the other and got paid.

    P J 

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    Mike.

    Interested to here you say different thicknesses is a red herring, as building control stipulated this on some apartments i was working on.

    I`m not saying you are wrong but surely building control don`t ask for this kind of thing for no reason.

    As for insulation, i was adviced to use rockwool acoustic insulation, which i have & have been very satisfied with.

    Baz

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    Mike

    Ditto Baz's experience with the BCO. As to the Rockwool that's based on the experience of having to insulate myself from a noisy neighbour a few years back where it was necessary to use several techniques combined to get the desired result. In terms of the correct material for a shed ordinary plasterboard may be less suitable than the green moisture-resistant variety, although that is somewhat harder to come by

    Scrit

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    Baz, Scrit,

    I would refer you to "The White Book".....the huge book by the leading manufacturer of plasterboard. 

    It isn't the different thicknesses of board that makes the difference, but it may well be that 2 different thickness boards were the most cost-efficient way of achieving the stipulated dB reduction. The calculation may have been made that 21mm total thickness of board was required, so the BCO said use 12mm & 9mm boards........it isn't the difference that is the important thing, it is the total thickness. (Actually, strictly, it is the weight per unit area that is the critical factor).

    Another factor is that there are different densities of board available. Working with it on site the difference you would notice is that 2 similar sized boards would weigh different amounts.

    I keep going back to the point, though, that plasterboard is not the right answer in a workshop, where inevitably the walls will get a bit of a bashing.

    Mike 

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    I enquired from one of the biggest insulation distributors in the country about this problem, they supplied me with comressed Rockwool slabs, cut to fit tightly between studs, worked very well, (I used it for an internal wall).

    Derek. 

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    The thing with plasterboard Mike is it`s a quarter the price of the same thickness ply.

    So you could have 2" of plasterboard for the price of one 1/2" thick ply.

    As for it not being being the right answer, both of my last workshops have been plaster boarded & i`ve had no problem, especially with noise. You stick two pieces together & you`ll find them fairly solid.

    My last house was terraced & my present is semi-detached, so in both cases my neighbours have been very close. As money is tight, i have found plasterboard to be the most cost effective way of cutting out the noise from inside my workshops.

    I`m not trying to say it`s the best to line walls with (i would have liked 3/4 ply) but when you`re on a budget, i don`t think you can beat it.

    Baz

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    Baz,

    I think a good compromise could be plasterboard with ply or stirling board (OSB) over the top, offering a bit of protection and something to screw to.

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    Mike

    I'd agree that plasterboard isn't the most durable, but cladding it with a timber product board will greatly assist. However, you're then introducing a combustible material...... which plasterboard is not. As Baz says PB is cheap as chips and on the whole an excellent insulator. And if damp resistance is required there are various grades of damp/moisture resistant PB around.  I've had to deal with differential thickness PB but it's always been in conjunction with mineral wool and often with an air space between the layers of PB being specified. 

    Scrit

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    The cheapest option is by far is plasterboard as sound insulation, if you not going for hightech stuff, is based on density. Put a couple of layers of regular half inch board and cover it with either ply or cladding. I only put cladding on one wall(where I've hung my tools) and left the other with plasterboards. It is same as any plaster you have inside your house and on top of that it is fire proof. Usually not an issue but next door is happy and so is insurance company.

    //Thomas 

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    The trick with sound insulation is to try and eliminate the conducting of the vibraions caused by noise , so if you fill all the void with the incorrect insulation the noise will travel , you are limited to what you can achieve given the studs travel from the inside of the building to the outside cladding , if you have 100mm studs try using 75mm insulation pushed to the outer skin,, leaving 25mm clear airflow for any moisture and to prevent the build up of stale air  , then fix a 25 extruded polystyrene product ( kingspan , celutex ) accross the face of the timbers covering all studs ( as you would with a board , then fix your plasterboard  / ply to that ,you will need longer fixings but you will find the transmission of sound will be greatly reduced and gain the heat insulation , but which ever way you do this , always use a 1200 gauge polythene and clad studs before fixing the board over the studs to prevent the ingress of water / moisture to the back of your plasterboard or ply as this will occur through the cladding and once in the cavity will then sweat and start to cause rot within

    There are proper accoustic bars available on the market made from 1.2 mm pressed galv shaped like a stretched out z , which you fix one layer of P/B then fix these up cross bonded to the studs then fix another layer of P/B , I have used these on a job for a customer who wanted a sound proof music room , and they proved to work well along with rockwool .

     Bottom line is Budget and how you get on with the neighbours .

     personaly I clad the inside of my W/shop using 18mm T&G Chipboard flooring that comes in sheets 600 x 2400 , get it form wickes less than £6 per sheet which makes it about £11.50 per 8x4 and doesnt matter what centres your studs are at as the joints dont need to join on a stud as long as they are bonded minimum of 450 . Also guarantees fixings every where .

     cheers

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    A couple of things on the above:

    firstly, if you are to leave an air gap, it should be between the external cladding of the building (be it feather-edge boarding or render or whatever) and the insulation. This will allow any interstitial condensation to dry-off from air movement........which wouldn't happen if the gap was the other side of the insulation.

    Secondly.........no building products "sweat".

    They do not produce water or vapour. A sheet of plastic left on a concrete floor might leave a dark damp patch and have a layer of moisture under it......but this is because it has trapped moisture that would have otherwise evaporated. Be very careful about using a vapour barrier in an intermittently heated shed.

    The danger is that you might produce a situation where both sides of the polythene can get damp. When you are in a heated shed for a while you will be producing significant amounts of water vapour, from your breath, sweat, cups of tea, finishing products etc, and the carrying capacity of the air is increased because of the heating. Remove the heat when you leave the shed and the vapour carrying capacity of the air plummets with the reducing temperature. This vapour then has to condense somewhere....... your cast-iron tool beds are a favourite place.......and the cold walls will be another. The inside face of the polythene will get wet, causing potential mould and rot problems.

    A timber clad shed in a rainstorm will have damp external walls.......the vapour from this could possibly condense on the outside of any polythene, again with unwanted consequences.

    My suggestion was for mineral wool and a wood-wool type acoustic board. This combination would be reasonable for sound reduction, and being a "breathing wall" would allow for the movement of vapour through the wall. This system will allow the air to dry off any condensate. Ply or OSB lining to the inside would also work, but would rely on good ventilation to the shed. If you are to use chipboard flooring be sure to use the green moisture resistant type.  

    Any timber frame should be on a masonry plinth to raise it a min of 150mm above the floor and ground level.

    Sambo.....just a quiet word........not sure about that for a nickname. Whilst risking the accusation of political correctness, a nickname like that can cause offence and might risk alienating people who would otherwise use this forum.

    Mike 

     

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